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| | The Love, Marriage, Relationships Network is not currently active and cannot accept new posts | | My Dad Had Another Saying... | Views: 336 | | Aug 16, 2005 11:07 am | | My Dad Had Another Saying... | # | 
Sue T. | | When a man loves a woman there isn't anything he won't do for her.
Now, at the time... I wasn't familiar with what the devil that man was talking about. I was about 19 or 20 yrs., old and I thought Ok.
Now that I've had some life experience under my belt, barring stalkers who want to control your every move, and they do exist, it's not caring about your day to be grilled and/or interrogated and be subjected to questioning which makes you feel uncomfortable. I'd say if that kind of conversation is going on, and you feel odd? Run don't walk in the other direction. It'll only get worse.
It doesn't mean he cares O'so much, it doesn't mean he's o'so interested in your day. If you're talking to a man who makes you feel funny? Then ... "believe that inner voice" don't make excuses there are about 300,000 other guys out there to chose from.
Ok :) heh... as I was saying, when a man cares about a woman, barring throwing himself off a building :) he will make time for her, do nice things, spoil her with little gifts and expect "nothing" in return.
There are those occassions where, a fella may do these things because he "is" expecting something in return, that will become evident over time. These type of guys attach a price tag to what they do... either in requesting more of your time than you are willing to give, not respecting you when you need time to yourself and start to pout and perhaps try to make you feel guilty, and yup... maybe even toss all those great things he did for you in there in order to do it.
Do not play that game. It should be viewed as a warning sign.
Granted, if you're going about your business and he has expectations that are not clear in regards to the relationship, you can ask him to clarify what it is that he's talking about. Yet in the same breath, if you still feel ... like he is using what he's done for you as a tool to manipulate you in any way? Involves consuming "all" of your time etc.,
He's got to go. :)
Sue Tosto
Life and Relationship Coach
Confidence is Silent. It doesn't defend itself.
It simply exists inside of you.
http://www.freewebs.com/dreamscape/index.html
http://www.xanga.com/home.aspx?user=DreamScapeIntPrivate Reply to Sue T. | | Aug 16, 2005 3:10 pm | | re: My Dad Had Another Saying... | # | 
Sandra Harmon | | Sue,
Your dad might be right, although total altruism is a trait I have not yet encountered in a man or a woman. And I would be suspicious of such selflessness. I think relationships are reciprocal, and should be.
But having said the above, I have not been talking about a man who is in love and will do anything for a woman. I am talking about dating, which is the stage where you learn about the degree of chemistry, compatibility and communication you both have together. You learn about his goals, finances, degree of ethics, morality, etc. and he learns about yours. He is courting you and you are allowing him to do so.
The one thing I advocate totally, however, is "No sex without comittment". No matter how cute, nice, sweet, sexy, rich, adoring, whatever this man appears to be, do not have sex with him until he gives you a "comittment" of monogomy, continuity and longevity; which does not necessarily mean marriage; only that you agree that you are both going in the same direction, toward marriage, if that is what you both decide.
Sandy Harmon Private Reply to Sandra Harmon | | Aug 16, 2005 3:51 pm | | re: re: My Dad Had Another Saying... | # |
Sue T. | | I see what you're saying and I agree. I think he was talking more along the lines of being good to a woman ... like we've been talking about. Respect, mutuality etc., course :) that was my interpretation of it, which I probably should have put here as well... I didn't review my original post though.
I have an article that I wrote, with regard to just how intoxicating the pull of sex can and is in a relationship... it can confuse the reality of what you are truly dealing with because, really if it is "good" sex a woman can make certain allowances and confuse the intimacy of a healthy relationship where there is mutuality, communication etc., with the intimacy and closeness that sex obviously creates ... it can give the woman the illusion of being "close" to this man.
However one form of intimacy should not be confused with the other.
I think women, may be uncomfortable making a man wait for sex and holding back. Really, if he's respectful of her wishes and waits, and wants the committed relationship, I agree as well it is better to wait. That attraction is "always" going to be there regardless... and it can be just that much more fun in the anticipation arena as well... :)
Course, whether or not it is good sex... is a thread of an entirely different color.
If a woman rushes into sex with a fella, and then after the good behavior period is over and she determines as to whether or not she wants to sleep with them, there is also that sexual separation to deal with as well... Which of course, can be avoided... :)
I'm writing reeeeeeeeally fast LOL I do hope I'm being clear.
Sue T.Private Reply to Sue T. | | Aug 16, 2005 4:59 pm | | re: Sandra - Dating VS IN LOVE - My Dad Had Another Saying... | # |
Susan Perkins | | What wonderful advice in this day and age!! Everyone it seems wants to hop in the sack after the first date or two - any wonder why I avoid that scenerio?
Dating is just that: Dating or courting if you will - to see if there is a possibility for something longer lasting - yes - a committed relationship to each other.
If people begin a relationship w/intimacy - that really destroys everything and the dynamics of that relationship have forever been changed. Women will typically "assume" that she has every right to ask questions where he was etc...."assuming" that he is "her" man since this line has now been crossed - the man just thinks he is still getting to know her - although they have been intimate...a horrible state of "affairs"... (couldn't resist that pun)
Anyway, the ole adage that "It is never as good as the first time!" is such a lie!!! As my ex-husband and I grew together - learned what each of us liked - developed our mental and emotional connections, our intimate life only improved!! For me, the first time is the worst...
What a "crock" of romanticism we Americans have been fed over the centuries...
Back to reality - work, Susan Private Reply to Susan Perkins | | Aug 16, 2005 5:02 pm | | Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Sue T. | | As I am sitting here... my mind is trailing off remembering those times where ... there was such an amazing attraction to said "date"... and this is a question both male and females want to think about... I mean "how" long is "long" enough?
In other words LOL In the song by meatloaf that boy married her and everything LOL because he just couldn't wait any longer... ! I thougth this was amuzing as all get out, so I had to include it...
Seriously though I mean... how long, is long enough? I've dated fella's who we were in a relationship for a while and we waited say, 4-6 weeks (I can't remember anymore) but times were different too. At 26 yrs old I had a heck of alot more time and freedom on my hands than I do now and we went out like all the time, a couple times a week. Big difference to my schedule now. (Wait, Wait Wait! I'm "not" saying I changed up boyfriends every six weeks either lol...)
So, we're all adults ... I mean what would constitute a reasonable waiting period for ??? not to the second... but I'm curious about that. I know, I can tell if I want to sleep with someone "attraction wise" not based on personality (that chemistry in like 5.0 seconds..) the person? Is another avenue, that doesn't take me long to figure out... whether I want to spend more time with them or not.
I'd say up to the individual ... yet each person takes x amount of time to get to see and know another... truly we don't "know" another for quite a while... (good lord shoot me now LOL)
So there ya go? Thoughts? Cold showers?
Sue T. Private Reply to Sue T. | | Aug 16, 2005 5:21 pm | | re: Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Sandra Harmon | | It is not about time, it is about comittment.
He should agree to monogomy You do not want to sleep with a man who is sleeping with other women. It is painful and possibly dangerous to your health.
He should agree to continuity. You do not want to sleep with a man who does not call you back.
He should agree to longevity. You and he must agree to be going in the same direction; i.e, marriage. You may not get there, but that is both your goal.
Most women will feel that they are in love with a man they have (good) sex with. It is Oxytocin, a hormone that a womans body produces. A man does not produce that much oxytocin. He can get "laid", zip up and go on.
Most men fall in love by the comittments they make and keep.
Therefore, if you want a level playing field, and dont want to be waiting for calls for a man whom you think you are in love with but who isnt in love with you, dont have sex until you get a comittment.
There is no time limit. You can feel the chemistry and wait for the comittment. And please do not respond by telling me that men will lie. Some men will but most wont. By the time you know him well enough to require a comittment, you probably have good enough sense of him.
And to the question of when to ask for this comittment I would advise you to wait until he asks you for sex. Then you ask him for a comittment and then you see if he is a man who cares enough about you to wait, or just a guy who want a good time.
So, yes. I recommend a cold shower or better yet, take a nice excerise class or a walk in the park.
xxxxxxx
Sandy Harmon
Private Reply to Sandra Harmon | | Aug 16, 2005 5:29 pm | | re: Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Susan Perkins | | Sue -
I think YOU need a cold shower!! :-)
It has been many, many years for me...what is waiting another year going to do while getting to know someone...
distance is a factor - how often you talk either on the phone, email or person....how often you see them....
many factors...religion....principles...upbringing....intuition...
but a month?? For me,,,,never.
Animals have "attractions" - look at the mules in Iraq - the marines are having a "hard" time keeping them from mating with one another while carrying their supplies...oh how I love puns....
We - humans are not animals - so much more comes into "play" - being "chaperoned" is a good idea - even with adults - in my estimation...
Okay - I'm ready for the bashing.....Susan :-) Private Reply to Susan Perkins | | Aug 17, 2005 12:24 am | | Sandra : Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Sue T. | | Hmmm I agree most will not lie about this. I see what you're saying about the committment first. And you know, the sex is always much better when you're comfortable with who you are with and "like" them to begin with...
I agree, again, that "good sex" can certainly feel like love, yet it isn't. It's just good sex. To break that kind of attachment can be difficult.
Usually you can, well I can spot a player anywhere... the signs are simple. If a woman feels "funny" about something a fella is or is not doing, the choice is hers to walk away and find someone who is on the same wave length.
Hey? Isn't sex exercise? :) Sorry lol I had to throw that in there...
Well distance can be good as well, make sure one is not in the position to get caught up... so to speak.
Sue T.Private Reply to Sue T. | | Aug 17, 2005 12:31 am | | Susan : Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Sue T. | | aaaaagh my love :) No bashing required. It's great you have your guidelines as to when you will or will not sleep with a fella... and review the factors which you have set for yourself as to what you are looking for... It's great!
In the same breath, you can't compare animal magnatism and attraction to mules in Iraq.
Have you never met someone you were instantly attracted to and found yourself wondering what it would be like to kiss him ... while he's talking and you're watching his lips move? and you don't hear a word he says?
Or slip away with him, and have him bury his hands in your hair, pulling your head back gently, while he kisses your neck...
See a glimpse of those broad tight shoulders when he removes his jacket ... before sitting down?
This kind of chemistry is good. Not animalistic...it's also healthy, and it feels good...
Kissing a man that you feel this with, can literally curl your toes... whether you wait a month ... or not.
I think I'd rather need a cold shower than turn off that amazing animal magnatism that simply exists between two people.
It's more about, waiting to see if the people match as well as the chemistry... that's the key point I believe.
XO
Sue T. Private Reply to Sue T. | | Aug 17, 2005 5:19 am | | re: Susan : Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Susan Perkins | | hmmmm - most interesting post Sue - might it be - could it be - that you have your sights on a particular dynamic man of late??? hmmmm???
You know - seems to me that I've seen a shift in your posts of late - yep ----something is going on in your world....from ranting about men in general - coming on to you at work...to.....
care to clue any of us in?? Must be some STRONG chemicals at "Play"....I can taste how BAD you need a COLD shower through my Cable lines....
How long has it been Sue??? Did you meet that man of your dreams - or are your dreams so real that....
Okay - I'll stop teasing you!!
Boy, I'm in a good mood - my friend Dean Hua just updated my Ryze page as a favor from a friend....talking about guys - HE is an awesome one and well-shaped calves like none I've seen before....
oh dear....I don't think he is a member of this network...is he??
Warmest, Susan
Private Reply to Susan Perkins | | Aug 17, 2005 10:03 am | | re: re: Susan : Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Sue T. | | Seems you have the two issues confused.
When I was ranting about men on the other board it was because he was married as you know, and it was unacceptable behavior. I was hurt and disgusted by his attempt to date me ... morally and every other way under the sun. There are many women who get schnookered into "dating" a married men when they hear his tails of woe. Thus they get hurt. That is one kind of statistic I don't plan on becoming.
Honey we're all sexual human beings. Attraction is a beautiful thing. In the same breath... you didn't answer my question as to if you've ever looked at some one you were attracted to and found him so enticing that you simply didn't want to wait... because there was that strong pull.
Men are great ... some are not... same goes for women, some are great some are not. It's particularly important to (generally speaking) to know what we are looking for and what we want in our own lives...
Yes Dean is a member here :) And I'm sure he may see the compliment and be flattered :) Nothing wrong with that!
Sue T.
p.s. As to the particular man of late? All of them :) Until I meet one that interests me.
Private Reply to Sue T. | | Aug 17, 2005 12:17 pm | | re: re: re: Susan : Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Sandra Harmon | |
Dear Sue,
Sexual attraction is a strong pull, there is no doubt about that. But if you are not going to wait for a comittment, how about waiting for an AIDS test. Please!!!!
Sandy Harmon Private Reply to Sandra Harmon | | Aug 17, 2005 4:02 pm | | re: Susan : Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Susan Perkins | | Hi Sue et al -
No - I didn't have two issues confused - I was in a great mood and was teasing you - that is all - I am a very playful spirit and get myself into trouble many, many times!!! Alas,,,,what's a woman to do.... :-)
To answer your serious question though - (I took it as you were slighly teasing, BTW,) No, I have not EVER met a man that I was so physically attracted to that I wanted to jump in bed with him right there - no matter how good looking. Outward looks has never done anything for me - sorry...
I have however (this is rare too - guess I'm far too picky and my sexual attraction to a man comes from how he "makes love" to my mind...which takes time....not how he looks)...found myself being enthralled with a mans lips and imagining what it would be like to kiss this person....still....only....after I've talked to them at length and find I really like what and how he speaks to me!!
Sue - it "seems" we are two "different animals" if you will....hehehehhhhh
Oohhhh,,,,me so bad,,,,love to play.....love it....with words....gee...what else have I had...all these..many...many...years....?????
Be "easy" with me!!!!! hehehehehhhhh, Susan :-) Private Reply to Susan Perkins | | Aug 17, 2005 4:29 pm | | Sandy & AIDS Test : Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Sue T. | | Ok. Allow me to start over. I'm 39 now. The initial post referenced when I was 26 years old.
Now. There is and has been the rule of a commitment first. Actually that's pretty much always been my way.
Also, there will not be any sexual hokey pokey unless I see the results of an HIV test. That is a requirement.
If the fella doesn't care about himself enough to get one, and my request to see it, willing to go myself and having been myself as well... then why waste my time? It's just that simple.
I'm not sure what I said about not waiting for that commitment, or how that came across what I was talking about was when there is that pull ... it can be distracting.
Am I being more clear? Jeeeez LOL
Sue T.Private Reply to Sue T. | | Aug 17, 2005 4:41 pm | | re: Sandy & AIDS Test : Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Sue T. | | p.s. I also prefer to date a man who is only dating me. If he's running around with Jane, Georgette and Tabitha ... he's already got a full plate. Men know what they like, why beat around the bush that way.
As is his prerogative to date as many people as he pleases. In the same breath I'd advise said person that just friends is fine and further, I prefer to date one man at a time.
One on one to see. I've never believed in that whole run around dating this one or that one, you date one person at a time. People know what they like and we can figure out if we like some one more than just friends over time. If he's investing that time, that says to me that he is interested in more than just runing off to the next person and he's closer to being more like minded towards having that comitted relationship.
Sue T. Private Reply to Sue T. | | Aug 17, 2005 4:53 pm | | re: re: Sandy & AIDS Test : Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Sandra Harmon | |
Thanks, Sue. Now you have put my mind at rest. It is true that I get a little motherly from time to time (sorry about that), but now that I found you, I dont want to lose you.
Unfortunately, many people think that AIDs will never happen to them so they don't bother to test. Just another form of denial, because although AIDs is now treatable, it is not yet preventable, so attention must be paid.
Mama Sandy Harmon
Private Reply to Sandra Harmon | | Aug 17, 2005 5:11 pm | | Appreciation : Sandy & AIDS Test : Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Sue T. | | I understand... :) I get that way myself LOL I'm highly protective as well...
I understand and I'm glad you asked.... :)
No worries... And I appreciate the apology. We can miss the conversation from start to finish when we see something that scares the bejesus out of us I undertand completely...
Wait LOL You've not seen me be protective yet ... at least I don't think so :)
No worries.
Sue T.Private Reply to Sue T. | | Aug 17, 2005 7:45 pm | | Reply Susan : Paradise by the Dashboard Light ... Meatloaf... :) | # |
Sue T. | | Hmmmm... I can see what you're saying ... :) I'm not upset, sincerely.
I'm very visual ... there are all flavors out there for all kinds of people. I can see too how you'd find a man more attractive after listening to how he speaks to you and gets into your mind as well, it makes it better too... so :)
Nah ... again, I'm not upset... :) We're not so different really... I understand what you're saying 100%.
At the same time, I can and still to this day...lol see a man and a woman kiss in a movie and when the scene is over my head is tilted like ... hmmmm that looked like a really nice kiss.
People are people Susan ... how I feel is no better than how you feel and visa versa :) SEE?! No chewing on you at all...
:) Sue T.Private Reply to Sue T. | | |
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